In the Interest of full disclosure…LET THE CHIPS FALL WHERE THEY MAY—Draw your own conclusions.Posted on June 7, 2015 by arnierosner
From NLA- The following statement is a clearly stated bold faced lie!
“Arnie clearly has plans going contrary to NLA, publically stating so, and we wished him well on his way and away from us. Now you have sidled up to him.”
This is also a bold faced lie!
Arnie Rosner, have all been removed from the NLA
Arnie removed his participation from the NLA based on repeated complaints from other members of misconduct on the part of NLA management.
Regarding the meeting in question:
Also Arnie was specifically invited to attend this meeting ostensively as an unbiased, independent advisor. Arnie has no skin in this game in Oregon.
[size=32]Arnie simply points out that Americans are sovereigns. As sovereigns, Americans are responsible for their own decisions and actions.[/size]
Some have made the observation that members of the NLA are engaged in the destruction of the common law grand jury process. A process which belongs to all Americans and not to the NLA. Yet the NLA seems to have taken steps to attempt to copyright the process.
Some have gone so far as to suggest that the NLA has been engaged by the dark forces to play this role. Sorry to openly expose some of the internal exchanges that might normally be private, but considering all of the subterfuge, it is my considered opinion, you—as an American— have a right to know as much of the truth that is available.
With respect to comments regarding Mr. Vrooman…
Ron has a very direct…”in your face,” approach to dealing with issues. Most people with something to hide are extremely uncomfortable being confronted in this manner.
I find Mr Vrooman’s approach to be refreshing, courageous and most needed to confront the many traitors to America who have infiltrated the ranks of unsuspecting Americans. If you are not 100% American…looking out for the interests of all Americans, you most assuredly do not want to be meeting with a man like Mr. Vrooman.
Americans must learn to judge people by their fruit and deeds not by their shallow and deceptive words.
If you have a problem with this—feel free to contact me personally for more direct discussion. Be reminded I demand equal time!
On Jun 7, 2015, at 10:28 AM,
After an aquaintance was jailed for 9 months on a parole violation, he got out and reported to me that the Georgia NLA list was shown to him by employees of “The Firm” (he believed it to be them). They showed him my name and asked if he knew me. When he said he did, they allegedly offered to wipe his record clean if he would give them dirt on me. That was months ago and he served his full time.
I tell you this because I believe John Durash is and was set up by “The Firm” for the express purpose of getting as many names as possible for their “Red dot” markers, signifying those to be taken out first.
We may never know the full truth of the matter but having convened one of the first modern day Common Law Grand Juries back in March of 2009 and then following up with ones in IL and then OH, leading up to the American Grand Jury after that, the results proved that modern day Judiciary and/or Law Enforcement were eager to ignore the resulting Presentments. That route was tried again and again after that, all with the same results.
Regardless of those results, comrade Durash, against my advice, continued to once again gather large numbers of names for the purpose of repeating this failed effort even though I showed him proof his idea would not work. My offer to help him retool his workers into a viable force for the good was consistently ignored.
Again I believe this was so because he never did anything with those names yet they still wound up in the hands of what I now believe are enemy combatants alphabet agencies).
By the way, did I mention that each and every one of those agencies are private, non-profit corporations?
The new lines are being drawn in this battle. Where are you on this?
To: Gary Jolley
Cc: ‘Guenter Ambron'; Jan Phillip Holland; ‘bbris55′; ‘David Haasl'; ‘Laura Weaver'; ‘Kambiz Moradi'; ‘Ross Abordokaninau'; firstname.lastname@example.org; email@example.com; ‘Dave Smith'; ‘Greg Bosin'; ‘oregon trackers'; ‘Bev'; ‘Carl Swensson'; ‘Williams Jim R'; ‘Mark Olmstead'; ‘Stash’
Subject: Re: OREGON CLGJ SPECIAL MEETING and Re: Members update (Gary Jolley)
People choose to send information to me. Sometimes I comment on it, sometimes not.
NLA officers should not let their good work swell their heads. Good management also includes knowing when to let go of control.
Unfortunately, high energy, fast moving, organization officers usually cannot tolerate dissent. Eventually organization fall apart after a period of unquestioned success.
John Darash has ignored my suggestions. He’s on a roll. I hope he is ultimately successful. But he picked a risky strategy. If it fails, a great disservice will have been done to the idea of a popular grand jury.
A wise patriotic advisor
On 6/6/2015 6:41 AM, Gary Jolley wrote:
Not sure how you became involved. For there to be any intervention here for Guenther you will need to speak to John Darash. Guenter expressed intent and actions contrary to NLA membership through interaction and cooperation with nefarious ex-members of NLA and we have learned through experience to nip it in the bud. We want ZERO association with that sort that has proven harmful to NLA and their membership in the past. If John wants to allow this, and he has not in the past, your intervention for Guenter might be helpful.
No meeting with National is going to gain traction. We are a group and Oregon joined this group. If Oregon has desires for alternate philosophies they are entirely welcome to entertain them. If the membership that joined NLA in Oregon wishes to follow Guenter they are also free to do so, we wish them well, but separately from NLA. Membership in NLA is not compulsory and we are gaining traction and association with us has been leveraged to bolster their differing ideologies. We are trying to stay a single course.
Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2015 2:55 AM
To: Guenter Ambron
Subject: Re: OREGON CLGJ SPECIAL MEETING and Re: Members update (Gary Jolley)
It’s nice to have national support. However, every local grand jury is a self forming, self perpetuating entity that operates without outside control.
A member of a grand jury can only be kicked off the grand jury by the local members of the grand jury.
Perhaps it’s time to review the Magna Carta regarding how a grand jury is formed and run.
On 6/5/2015 6:25 PM, Guenter Ambron wrote:
Unified Oregon Common Law Grand Jury
SPECIAL CONFERENCE CALL MEETING
SATURDAY, JUNE 6TH, 10AM
Dial in Number: 712-775-7035
Access Code: 932589#
Topic: Co-coodinator / Oregon member removal by NLA
I need you all in on this that can make the 10 am meeting Saturday. It has been announce that I have been removed from our Oregon CLGJ Group and I’m removed from the NLA. The accusation is that I am siding with Ron Vrooman and Arnie to take our Unified Oregon Common Law Grand Jury down a dangerous slope away from the NLA plan. Read below for the details of the matter.
Sorry Dave, this is more than I had intended, agreed to do as per our last talk, but I feel it’s important that this is fully out in the open. We can discuss the solutions starting at 9:30 am with Robert and Gary Jolley if they show. Thanks again for your support. You should likely moderate the meeting. I’ll set up the call.
Note to Gary Jolley:
My apologies Gary, I have redrafted my note of earlier and submitted it below. I am also sending this out to all of our Oregon members.
Since October of 2014 I have taken a good bit of time out of my local liberty, political, and other work to support the NLA and specifically the Oregon CLGJ group.
Dave Hassl first mentioned about Ron’s behavior May 20th, and I took it as him, just being argumentative on calls a bit in the past with Robert Bristow. About Arnie I didn’t have a clue. Dave just recently told me about an argument he had with Ron, when I wasn’t at the meeting.
My full purpose is to help this movement, the Oregon Common Law Grand Jury and to help NLA.
I believe in upholding just processes for just ends.
The note of dismissal that came from you, signed only ‘Gary’, by way of firstname.lastname@example.org. was out of the blue… since we haven’t met.
Then a following note by Robert Bristow – TO ALL OREGON, announcing that I am allied with Arnie and Ron and that we have decided to go our own way. That is deeply contrary and a misrepresentation of my actions and intentions.
Was it a decision by the NLA Board, or just a few members to remove me?
Why didn’t anyone contact me, personally and explain the issue first before issuing judgement? and expulsion?
Like I said earlier I don’t know the history of Arnie, Ron V. and NLA. Ron had mentioned he was kicked out of NLA twice. I did not know anything about Arnie’s status with NLA except at the last conference meeting. I just need to understand more of what is going on and what this business about? No real details have been forth coming on what the THREAT IS other than what Dave Hassl and Dave Smith have just recently discussed with me about Ron’s brash attitude at times. Once again I feel I have no real authority to expell someone especially as to what seems to me a misdemeanor and an issue of conduct. I believe it is up to the Group, as a whole to take this action to bar someone if they feel Ron, or Arnie are contrary to support UOCLGJ plan to work on the NLA plank. Again they are the ones to issue the notice and then direct the coordinator.
We need everyone we can get to help build and support our group and an outreach program. My suggested solution is: A pledge of conduct and alliance, or re-alliance should be considered first before taking such an extreme action. Because of this matter I have lost Katherine one of our Josephine County Coordinators. She’s fed up with the negative energy and unproductivity.
Again my recommendation is expulsion should be the group’s decision, or they should delegate it, not a unilateral one by one or two members of NLA.
I invite you, Robert, Gary and anyone else from NLA to sit in with Dave Hassl and I on a pre-meeting just before our regularly scheduled meeting on Saturday at 9:30 PST. I’ll be using this as a notice.
My hope and prayer is that we can grow from this and get back to organizing, recruiting and follow through with the NLA plan.
We have a meeting on Saturday Morning 10am.
We need to do the right thing.
May your day’s journey be all that it can be and find you smiling back at it.
With Gratitude and appreciation
On Jun 5, 2015, at 11:28 AM, Gary Jolley wrote:
I cannot follow your statements in this email. Add to the incomplete sentences I just do not follow. Sorry. I see you put in a great deal of time on this. But your interest in entertaining Ron and Arnie appear in this email as well.
Be advised…we are not going to go back in time and email relating to Arnie and Ron to prove anything to you. If you really need this information I feel that you are currently in the right place to do your own thing at this time.
I do not know what else to say. I just cannot follow this whole thing.
On Jun 2, 2015, at 6:02 PM, Gary Jolley wrote:
Like my mother used to say…you are judged by the company you keep. It used to irritate me when she said this. In this case it is true. This is why you are no longer Oregon State Coordinator for Oregon.
BTW Guenter, it was not my decision to oust you so naming me as a villain is a gross false assumption.
Arnie clearly has plans going contrary to NLA, publically stating so, and we wished him well on his way and away from us. Now you have sidled up to him.
This is a critical time, as well as a dangerous time and if one member does something contrary to NLA we will not have that backing of the NLA to rescue us, especially something we are warned against. Following Arnie, liken to the Florida and Colorado debacle, on a path that could be dangerous is crazy. NLA is going to do it the NLA way, and that is it. Oregon state joined the NLA, not the other way around.
If Oregon wants to mingle with other ideologies they are free to do so, just do it on your own and steer clear of the Unified Oregon Common Law Grand Jury name and P.O. Box. Already in Colorado the Sheriffs have distinguished the difference between the splinter group from NLA and the actual NLA. Do not be fooled so late in the game.
Ron Vrooman approached you from a purely personal need and desired an accelerated Grand Jury of 25 in Oregon because of his serious legal difficulties. He did this same thing a few months ago and earned himself his expulsion. As good as this sounds, we fear it will land 25 good people in jail and the NLA will be powerless to help you. Look what is happening to Terry Trussell. I know that in long distance running the runners in the last legs of the race sprint ahead, but, we cannot do this as we are not lone runners. We represent many and could spoil the whole bushel.
Guenter, you are where you are currently because of a serious lapse in judgment. Speak up…what are your plans? Tell Oregon whether they are NLA or not.
Robert, Jan, Gary
From: Guenter Ambron [mailto:email@example.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2015 5:05 PM
Cc: David Haasl; Kambiz Moradi; firstname.lastname@example.org Koenig; Ross Abordokaninau; email@example.com;firstname.lastname@example.org; Dave Smith; oregon trackers; Arnie Rosner; Carl Swensson; email@example.com; Mark Olmstead;firstname.lastname@example.org; email@example.com; bbris55; RJELROY@aol.com; firstname.lastname@example.org; Ron Vrooman; Kahterine Harmony48; True Light; email@example.com; firstname.lastname@example.org
Subject: Re: Members update
Dear Friends, and Unified Oregon (rising)
Regarding Ron Vrooman, Arnie, Gary Jolley, Robert Bristow, NLA ban
There is no personal contact on these matters with me – especially by Gary Jolley nor anything really from Robert Bristow other than the email below. I don’t understand what the beef is all about other than differences of understanding, belief, bickering of matters, procedures.
I have work extensively to try and help the Oregon Coordinator Laura Walker, since January, ( not to mention Josephine County CLGJ) by taking minutes of meetings and offering support. When she moved and was unable to support the work, no one stepped in. Robert Bristow did host a few meetings and then I asked Dave Hassl, in late March, if he would help – step in with me and us be Co-coodinators, share the job for now until we get an outreach campaign together and recruited enough people and have a standing committee of 29.
I don’t really know the story of Ron V.’s conflict with NLA and being kicked out a few times now it is. What are the real issues, or threats??, How is that affecting us here at the United Oregon CLGJ. I have talked with Dave Smith (Freedom Dave) just last night about this and with Dave Hassl earlier. Both of them have difficulty with Ron V. and so I agreed, earlier, that we needed to have Ron V. step back, for time, as we are too new, too few right now and need to be at our best behavior to support recruitment. Keep the infighting out. Have the parties resolve it themselves perhaps, I’ll help if I can behind the scenes. I received Robert B.’s emil. I have posted it below which covers the matter. I talked with Robert B. the morning of our Saturday meeting.
At our Meeting Saturday, May 30th Arnie and Ron V. came in. I addressed my concern about the NLA ban, having these issues dragged out at the beginning the meeting, not the tone setter I wanted. The NLA issue needs to be discussed at another time, separate from this meeting, or at the end as an item of discussion.
I agreed with Dave Hassl to support having Ron V. step back, but I can not support banning anyone with out a proper hearing and a clear direction from Our UOCLGJ group. I felt bad that we lost Freedom Dave, who was at the meeting earlier but then left when I directed a question to him and Ron V. answered. But after that we had a productive meeting with both Arnie and Ron V. making supportive contributions.
I have been a veteran of community building, peace keeping, conducting and moderating meetings for 25 years. We are a liberty and justice oriented group trying to deal with corruption. Well, we need to be a better examples of the principles we want to live up to. Point blank – Right here in our own circles.
My Recommendation as a Peace Keeper and moderator is that NLA leaders back off on it’s accusations and sanctions agains oregon members. A clear case must be presented with sufficient evidence to UOCLGJ and then let us make a ruling on the matter. NLA, all of us, need to follow and practice the principles, (placing them before personalities).
I must prepare for our meeting at 6pm. I wish I could have spent this energy in providing more support on materials for the meeting. But it is apparent we need to deal with this issue now. So then, let’s give it our best.
May we ever be grateful for our walk upon this great earth with our creator, Jesus, that dwells in our hearts. Let us continue to make that two foot drop to dwell there within as we work together for a better future.
I look forward to having you all at the meeting and working things out. I pray.
Meeting time 6pm
Call in # and Pass
I just realized I made a mistake on the day. It’s Tuesday not Wednesday that the meeting is Scheduled. OK I’ll have to call everyone now.
[url=tel:%28712%29 775-7035](712) 775-7035[/url]
On Jun 2, 2015, at 3:31 PM, Natural Harmony48 wrote:
Please remove my name from NLA.
There is way to much bickering and wrong energy going on. I have been watching things and have not gotten involved because of it. No one will succeed in this all important movement without unity.
Guenter is extremely good at unity and organization. I wish to support him. He has the correct energy to succeed.
I have been waiting this out some to make sure I want to take this action. With the last two emails I have received, I am now certain.
Please remove my name from NLA.
Josephine County, Oregon
On Jun 2, 2015 2:01 PM, “National Liberty Alliance” wrote:
To all Oregon nembers :
BE AWARE :……………. Arnie Rosner, Ron Vrooman and Guenter have all been removed from the NLA and the Unified Oregon Common Law Grand Jury. They have all made the decision to go their own way. We wish them well but They are no longer to use any of our papers and or names such as NLA, National Liberty Alliance Or anything in any way attached to NLA or Unified Oregon Common Law Grand Jury.
David Haasl is now the lead coordinator for Oregon. Please give David your support
On May 30, 2015, at 6:36 PM, Gary Jolley wrote:
It is with a sad heart that we must announce the removal of Gunny as the State Coordinator of Oregon. His actions as of late are dangerous to the Oregon membership. If we are going to suffer for our beliefs, we want them to be for the good of all, not a single individual. As much pain as there is out there, we must keep our eye on our goal for the Common law and the Common Law Grand Jury for ALL.
We are now looking for someone to assist David as State Coordinator. This person must have the interests of the members of NLA from Oregon in mind, but also the entire Nation of America as a whole. If you are interested please reply to this message.
On May 27, 2015 3:53 PM, “Guenter Ambron” wrote:
Pardon the lag. I had to step back just bit and attend other important issues.
I see that Ron isn’t at all hassle free… :) ops – I just thought of that as a pun after writing it… not intended.
I will support what ever will move us forward. My commitment is to work with you and the others that are dedicated, form the committee, get our work done.
I have allot on the table from all the extensive work I’ve been involved with within our community here to educate ourselves on the core issues the last 10 years. A big investment. Greed, selfishness, and ignorance are on the top of the list, but that’s aided by a predisposition of this covert slave trade culture.
I need to reach Robert Bristow, Rhonda on our paper work and having it all together where we, and I can access it, have copies, be sure they are filed, etc. Or do I need to redo the process here for JoCo. I need to be on the record, with documents in hand to show the legitimacy of what we are doing and in forming a common law GJ. I can not fully recruit people until I have that secured. I’m glad your practically there.
I will support you, especially in principle. If Ron is not cooperative with our efforts, or disruptive, that will fall on us to consider. But for now it looks, from my end, more personal.
I have to go out for a woodland walk break. I’ll try to reach you by phone by 6pm.
Thanks Dave for your work in NLA and CLGJ.
On May 24, 2015, at 9:16 PM, David Haasl wrote:
Funny, stay away from Ron. He is out there and will destroy anything we have built.
On May 24, 2015, at 9:12 PM, David Haasl wrote:
Ron Varrooman is off the rails. He is no longer needed in the Oregon unified common law grand jury. He is a non unifier.Please remove him from all contacts. Call me if there is a problem.
Thanks to: http://scannedretina.com