Sat Mar 23, 2024 11:33 pm by globalturbo
Dealing with Debt Collectors – overcome the fear!
I have put this document together to assist others and is based on my own personal experience and research.
REMEMBER;
YOU ARE STANDING WITHIN YOU RIGHTS UNDER COMMON LAW. NO DEAD CORPORATION HAS ANY AUTHORITY OVER YOU UNLESS YOU GIVE IT CONSENT TO STAND OVER YOU.
My approach in this is based on the OPPT UCC filings that were effective on 25 December 2012. I chose this approach as my research on this action resonated with me as being the most logical remedy that is available to anyone and is the most user-friendly method of lawful remedy against the current unlawful corporate system.
My experience only covers consumer lending products as I have never had, or will have a mortgage. From the experience of others, the battle over land holding is vastly more complex as ultimately you are fighting the Crown that allegedly owns the land.
The information below is just knowledge and does not change regardless of whether or not you have applied the OPPT Courtesy Notice process or not. But, if you have Debt Collectors coming to you and you have not put some remedy process into play to fight against the original contract then you don’t have much to leverage and most likely will left asking yourself what do you hope to achieve.
Summary of Debt Collectors
The first thing to understand about Debt Collectors is that they have no authority over you and can only utilize a very limited and largely powerless approach to law. They work predominantly from a basis of fear and will apply a vast amount of psychological tools against you to scare you into compliance.
Debt Collectors never have a contract with your wet-ink signature that can be used as an agreement for you to “stand-under” there alleged authority. The Debt Collector is a third-party interloper that has been engaged by the original organization that you may have a contract with.
Remember that the whole process that banks and governments follow is a dry, impersonal process that is largely automated. It requires input at each stage of the process from the minions that work at the lower levels of the bank or government agency. Those minions have to input 0/1 type data and cannot deviate from this. This is why when you first send a Courtesy Notice it is a surprise to still get a letter of demand or a Debt Collector come after you; Don’t be surprised, the lower level minions can’t close off a contract as it is well above their pay level and the system is also designed to wear you down into submission anyway.
So keep following through and smash back any ball they fire at you ;)
Debt Collector Agenda?
Being a third-party interloper, the Debt Collector is essentially parasitic in nature and over many years has developed a very good relationship with the premium-level feeders of human energy – the banks and governments. It has become evident to me that the large corporations now rely on the Debt Collectors at a much earlier stage in the collection process and seem to be the completely outsourced solution for collections that used to be managed internally. It is for this reason that you can never reason with them or negotiate with them. You simply stand your ground (in law) and deflect them.
There are many back-end processes that the original bank or government organization will go through to engage a Debt Collector Agency. The end result is largely the same; the agency will be the worker drone and sent out to you to coerce you into complying with the original contract, they will check any assets that are part of the original contract (car, etc) and apply a host of powerless threats. They essentially want to get you to offer something (usually $$) hoping to keep you playing the game.
Game-play
All of the Debt Collectors that have approached me have done so in a similar way even though they are from different companies. I will go through the stages of communication here and clarify the agency methods and your corresponding reply.
Letters sent to you
A letter from a Debt Collector is basically a letter of extortion in order to try and extract money from you without a contract, with no authority and through the application of fear.
The more lucrative Debt Collection Agencies will have letters that look the most impressive and mimic those commonly issued by the big banks or government agencies. They will use all sorts of bar codes, alpha-numeric codes and lots of legalese language to imply that you are a criminal of some sort and they have authority.
At the end of the day, the Debt Collection Agency is not a legal authority, has no contract with you and is no more powerful than your local McDonalds outlet. It’s all bluff, pure and simple.
Your response to any letter works best if you have already engaged in some form of remedy process as you can simply deflect the Debt Collector back to this. If you have already sent a Courtesy Notice to the original alleged bank or government agency, then simply recall the CN number and include it in your response to the Debt Collector along with an invoice for a fee as outlined in the CN fee schedule. Of course you can send a new CN to the Debt Collector if you wish.
If they send another threatening letter, just carry out the same response – an invoice for fees that cover their actions. If they are persistent just make sure your responses are getting to areal person within the Debt Collector agency. They like to make up fictitious names for those letters (yeah that’s the type of people we are dealing with here – cowards). So go for a mid level manager that can be found by doing a Google search, the company website or Linkedin. CEOs and Directors will also largely ignore your attempts to contract with the CN under Common Law whereas the mid-level managers are scared of the CN and therefore wish to avoid trouble.
Ignore all threats of legal action and once they know you have engaged with the Courtesy Notice action they should drop your case after the first response.
Fear – Home delivery
It seems that the Debt Collectors that don’t send an impressive letter of demand or don’t send a letter at all will deploy a drone to come pay you a visit. This drone, in the form of a human, will turn up to your home unannounced and uninvited and try to deploy fear tactics directly. This is done as this is a more effective way of dispensing the fear mantra.
Step 1 – greetings
Like all good Debt Collectors they will never lead into any conversation with you by introducing themselves, so, the first step is to engage them in this conversation;
“Who are you, where are you from and can I see some ID please”
Resist their repeated efforts to ignore you and push past you to try and request to speak to “Mr or Mrs xxxx”. Just keep coming back to them with the same above question until you have completely identified them (getting a business card is a good idea). Some folks have even gone as far as to call up the office that they claim to be from and confirm with that office that the person presenting themselves at your door is who they say they are. This also works in your favor in putting the drone on the back-foot a bit and letting them know that you will not be pushed around and warms you up for the ensuing exchange.
You can identify who you are to the drone once you are happy you have a solid identity. I find it is better to cut to the chase and give your full name but withhold any further information they may request stating “I am not under any obligation to provide that information to you” and then jump straight into a question to them asking “What is your business here today?” Always lead the questioning as much as possible.
Some folks simply end at the identification stage and simply tell the drone that they are trespassing and impeding your human right to privacy. You can add that the organization that the drone is working on behalf of (bank, government etc) already knows your stance (via the CN) and that you will be in touch with them to sort this out (send an invoice for the intrusion by the Debt Collector).
Your choice how you wish to play here on…
Step 2 – rules of engagement
I have found that this is a good time to help educate these guys about the changes coming through. Explain to them about the OPPT UCC Filings along with any other significant movements you are aware of. Provide website addresses and tell them they better go and look at it for their own benefit as it will effect them. I also like to add that the UCC Filings will soon be enforced by the UN Provost Marshal Office as explained by Deryl Zeleny in his radio interview from last year. Another good one is the roll-out of Common Law grand jury all over the world that are fast moving to replace the old Admiralty Law system with arrests orders being placed against those who have denied people their Common Law rights. So you don’t want your name on any of those lists ;)
Once the pleasantries are out of the way it will be time to get down to business. Remember, for the Drone, he will want to develop a contract (however loose) and come away with some form of commitment from you to pay some money. This is not the outcome you want here, as it will destroy all previous work you may have done and you might as well fall back inline and see the contract out.
So, as described above, once you have solid ID and given the drone minimal ID in return push them for what they actually want. Do not answer any further questions until they commit to delivering their well rehearsed spiel. This retort will comprise of quoting you some figures for outstanding money owed and dates etc and then usually ends with “Do you have any idea when you will pay this arrears?” This is the point of demand and where you get to push back.
Your response will simply be “The (bank or government) has my response in writing and I will be following up with them to resolve this issue.” That’s it. You do not need to engage with the drone any further and simply keep saying that “You have my response, so I bid you a good day and thanks for dropping by”.
On one occasion a Debt Collector pulled out a document and asked me to sign it in order to give his agency permission to come and tow the vehicle in question. This was an easy one to get sorted. I flatly refused to sign anything and that was my right not to sign a contract with him or his agency. His comeback was, “Well, they will have to now push the request through the courts to get an order.” I knew that was bluff and just responded by saying “You are free to do whatever you feel you need to do.” He left shortly after that.
Further ideas
If you get a persistent drone that won’t seem to leave or gets a bit overbearing you could always draw up a CN on the spot and serve that then ask them to leave. Pays to have some pre-signed CNs (Action type) handy that you can grab if need be.
My attitude towards the Debt Collectors is based on pity and compassion and because they are generally powerless I don’t often get them involved with the CN process. Maybe I have been lucky, but the drones that have shown up at my door have been relatively harmless and so once they knew about my standing they dropped the case and were never heard from again. But your choice, you are well within your freewill right to invoice them under the existing CN or another separate CN.
https://www.facebook.com/notes/glen-wallis/dealing-with-debt-collectors-work-in-progress-to-help-a-friend/10152066093877078?fref=nf
Share this:
Thanks to: http://ascendingstarseed.wordpress.com
Rate This
I have put this document together to assist others and is based on my own personal experience and research.
REMEMBER;
YOU ARE STANDING WITHIN YOU RIGHTS UNDER COMMON LAW. NO DEAD CORPORATION HAS ANY AUTHORITY OVER YOU UNLESS YOU GIVE IT CONSENT TO STAND OVER YOU.
My approach in this is based on the OPPT UCC filings that were effective on 25 December 2012. I chose this approach as my research on this action resonated with me as being the most logical remedy that is available to anyone and is the most user-friendly method of lawful remedy against the current unlawful corporate system.
My experience only covers consumer lending products as I have never had, or will have a mortgage. From the experience of others, the battle over land holding is vastly more complex as ultimately you are fighting the Crown that allegedly owns the land.
The information below is just knowledge and does not change regardless of whether or not you have applied the OPPT Courtesy Notice process or not. But, if you have Debt Collectors coming to you and you have not put some remedy process into play to fight against the original contract then you don’t have much to leverage and most likely will left asking yourself what do you hope to achieve.
Summary of Debt Collectors
The first thing to understand about Debt Collectors is that they have no authority over you and can only utilize a very limited and largely powerless approach to law. They work predominantly from a basis of fear and will apply a vast amount of psychological tools against you to scare you into compliance.
Debt Collectors never have a contract with your wet-ink signature that can be used as an agreement for you to “stand-under” there alleged authority. The Debt Collector is a third-party interloper that has been engaged by the original organization that you may have a contract with.
Remember that the whole process that banks and governments follow is a dry, impersonal process that is largely automated. It requires input at each stage of the process from the minions that work at the lower levels of the bank or government agency. Those minions have to input 0/1 type data and cannot deviate from this. This is why when you first send a Courtesy Notice it is a surprise to still get a letter of demand or a Debt Collector come after you; Don’t be surprised, the lower level minions can’t close off a contract as it is well above their pay level and the system is also designed to wear you down into submission anyway.
So keep following through and smash back any ball they fire at you ;)
Debt Collector Agenda?
Being a third-party interloper, the Debt Collector is essentially parasitic in nature and over many years has developed a very good relationship with the premium-level feeders of human energy – the banks and governments. It has become evident to me that the large corporations now rely on the Debt Collectors at a much earlier stage in the collection process and seem to be the completely outsourced solution for collections that used to be managed internally. It is for this reason that you can never reason with them or negotiate with them. You simply stand your ground (in law) and deflect them.
There are many back-end processes that the original bank or government organization will go through to engage a Debt Collector Agency. The end result is largely the same; the agency will be the worker drone and sent out to you to coerce you into complying with the original contract, they will check any assets that are part of the original contract (car, etc) and apply a host of powerless threats. They essentially want to get you to offer something (usually $$) hoping to keep you playing the game.
Game-play
All of the Debt Collectors that have approached me have done so in a similar way even though they are from different companies. I will go through the stages of communication here and clarify the agency methods and your corresponding reply.
Letters sent to you
A letter from a Debt Collector is basically a letter of extortion in order to try and extract money from you without a contract, with no authority and through the application of fear.
The more lucrative Debt Collection Agencies will have letters that look the most impressive and mimic those commonly issued by the big banks or government agencies. They will use all sorts of bar codes, alpha-numeric codes and lots of legalese language to imply that you are a criminal of some sort and they have authority.
At the end of the day, the Debt Collection Agency is not a legal authority, has no contract with you and is no more powerful than your local McDonalds outlet. It’s all bluff, pure and simple.
Your response to any letter works best if you have already engaged in some form of remedy process as you can simply deflect the Debt Collector back to this. If you have already sent a Courtesy Notice to the original alleged bank or government agency, then simply recall the CN number and include it in your response to the Debt Collector along with an invoice for a fee as outlined in the CN fee schedule. Of course you can send a new CN to the Debt Collector if you wish.
If they send another threatening letter, just carry out the same response – an invoice for fees that cover their actions. If they are persistent just make sure your responses are getting to areal person within the Debt Collector agency. They like to make up fictitious names for those letters (yeah that’s the type of people we are dealing with here – cowards). So go for a mid level manager that can be found by doing a Google search, the company website or Linkedin. CEOs and Directors will also largely ignore your attempts to contract with the CN under Common Law whereas the mid-level managers are scared of the CN and therefore wish to avoid trouble.
Ignore all threats of legal action and once they know you have engaged with the Courtesy Notice action they should drop your case after the first response.
Fear – Home delivery
It seems that the Debt Collectors that don’t send an impressive letter of demand or don’t send a letter at all will deploy a drone to come pay you a visit. This drone, in the form of a human, will turn up to your home unannounced and uninvited and try to deploy fear tactics directly. This is done as this is a more effective way of dispensing the fear mantra.
Step 1 – greetings
Like all good Debt Collectors they will never lead into any conversation with you by introducing themselves, so, the first step is to engage them in this conversation;
“Who are you, where are you from and can I see some ID please”
Resist their repeated efforts to ignore you and push past you to try and request to speak to “Mr or Mrs xxxx”. Just keep coming back to them with the same above question until you have completely identified them (getting a business card is a good idea). Some folks have even gone as far as to call up the office that they claim to be from and confirm with that office that the person presenting themselves at your door is who they say they are. This also works in your favor in putting the drone on the back-foot a bit and letting them know that you will not be pushed around and warms you up for the ensuing exchange.
You can identify who you are to the drone once you are happy you have a solid identity. I find it is better to cut to the chase and give your full name but withhold any further information they may request stating “I am not under any obligation to provide that information to you” and then jump straight into a question to them asking “What is your business here today?” Always lead the questioning as much as possible.
Some folks simply end at the identification stage and simply tell the drone that they are trespassing and impeding your human right to privacy. You can add that the organization that the drone is working on behalf of (bank, government etc) already knows your stance (via the CN) and that you will be in touch with them to sort this out (send an invoice for the intrusion by the Debt Collector).
Your choice how you wish to play here on…
Step 2 – rules of engagement
I have found that this is a good time to help educate these guys about the changes coming through. Explain to them about the OPPT UCC Filings along with any other significant movements you are aware of. Provide website addresses and tell them they better go and look at it for their own benefit as it will effect them. I also like to add that the UCC Filings will soon be enforced by the UN Provost Marshal Office as explained by Deryl Zeleny in his radio interview from last year. Another good one is the roll-out of Common Law grand jury all over the world that are fast moving to replace the old Admiralty Law system with arrests orders being placed against those who have denied people their Common Law rights. So you don’t want your name on any of those lists ;)
Once the pleasantries are out of the way it will be time to get down to business. Remember, for the Drone, he will want to develop a contract (however loose) and come away with some form of commitment from you to pay some money. This is not the outcome you want here, as it will destroy all previous work you may have done and you might as well fall back inline and see the contract out.
So, as described above, once you have solid ID and given the drone minimal ID in return push them for what they actually want. Do not answer any further questions until they commit to delivering their well rehearsed spiel. This retort will comprise of quoting you some figures for outstanding money owed and dates etc and then usually ends with “Do you have any idea when you will pay this arrears?” This is the point of demand and where you get to push back.
Your response will simply be “The (bank or government) has my response in writing and I will be following up with them to resolve this issue.” That’s it. You do not need to engage with the drone any further and simply keep saying that “You have my response, so I bid you a good day and thanks for dropping by”.
On one occasion a Debt Collector pulled out a document and asked me to sign it in order to give his agency permission to come and tow the vehicle in question. This was an easy one to get sorted. I flatly refused to sign anything and that was my right not to sign a contract with him or his agency. His comeback was, “Well, they will have to now push the request through the courts to get an order.” I knew that was bluff and just responded by saying “You are free to do whatever you feel you need to do.” He left shortly after that.
Further ideas
If you get a persistent drone that won’t seem to leave or gets a bit overbearing you could always draw up a CN on the spot and serve that then ask them to leave. Pays to have some pre-signed CNs (Action type) handy that you can grab if need be.
My attitude towards the Debt Collectors is based on pity and compassion and because they are generally powerless I don’t often get them involved with the CN process. Maybe I have been lucky, but the drones that have shown up at my door have been relatively harmless and so once they knew about my standing they dropped the case and were never heard from again. But your choice, you are well within your freewill right to invoice them under the existing CN or another separate CN.
https://www.facebook.com/notes/glen-wallis/dealing-with-debt-collectors-work-in-progress-to-help-a-friend/10152066093877078?fref=nf
Share this:
Thanks to: http://ascendingstarseed.wordpress.com
